Discuss! Now! please.


I think Cuddy is more human this episode, but I understand her coldness in the past episodes. It's more of she was doing her job, and all those failed Invitro's maybe were bringing her down and in order to not fall apart at work. She became cold, because I know if I wanted kids and I failed to conceive numerous times I'd be pretty bummed out. Ok so maybe I don't remember everything that goes on the episodes as I don't have a way to record them and so I can't go back and double check things like alot of you people can, that wasn't me being bitter.

I understand why Wilson sold out House, and I'm sure most people do to. If I was him I'd do the same thing I keep siding with Wilson lately. Maybe We're meant to side with him and I'm just another Television viewer that is influenced by what the writers wants the audience to do.

Umm Did we know that Foreman had a brother? If so what episode(s) was that mentioned in?

I'm glad someone else besides House solved the case, it reminds us, that House is not God. I don't mean that in a literal sense but it seems like most of us fans tend to put House up on a pedastal (Ok I give up I can't spell the damn word). We at least I did needed to realize that House is capable of screwing up. Even if the writers are saying House performs better with his pills. It's been said we get it.

I'm not getting too detailed or analytical here but: loved it. Was particularly stunned by Tritter's accusation towards Cuddy. Did I hear that right? I don't have tivo... or a dv-r... or vhs... so did he blame her for not controlling House's pain or did he blame her for failing to cover up House's addiction? Either way- telling story.

Also- House this ep- out of control. Obviously impacted.. out of focus... yet he still manages to try to do his job (though he does actually get this one wrong). Loved that he got it wrong- for the simple fact that it shows what kind of impact this is having on him. It occurred to me tonight that this is probably a realistic situation: a chronic pain sufferer addicted to drugs- you can't actually tell if it's because of the pain or because of the addiction that they want the pills. In House's case, it appears to be both and Hugh Laurie (as always) does this awesome job of portraying pain- especially at the end scene with the ducks in the office- when he yells at them.
And downs the last vicodin beeeecccaaauuusseeee... he's out of control and realizes it? Or because he realizes he has to go talk to parental figures? He's waiting for the right moment the whole episode. So if he got the vicodin and is semi- in control... why the punch? He seemed as astounded by it as Chase. Begs the question and raises the fanfic flag- post-ep anyone?

Nice episode. The PotW was adorable. The mom, not so much. Her line to House--"I'm the mother. I outrank you."--would usually make me admire her, but she was just so sullen and abrasive the whole episode. I didn't notice the dad as much, but he seemed like sort of a chicken.

I did like that judge. "Honestly, I figured I'd get a different judge today." Hee. ^^

I liked Foreman in this one. We didn't see too much of him, but he seemed like he was back to his old self, especially in the scene with Tritter. For all that Foreman makes snide comments about House being a junkie, he has also consistently argued, at least after Detox, that House is in legitimate pain and needs the Vicodin. I don't even care why he believes that--after this whole complicated mess House's addiction has become, it's a refreshing viewpoint to me.

Cameron...was oddly unobtrusive this time. I like it. :P "Thank you for your help?" She's a better person than I am. <_<

Aww, Chase. The not-so-sensitive riding from Foreman and Cameron about his father and his sucking up, then having his account frozen, then Tritter taking him to lunch, then Foreman accusing him (with good reason, that makes it worse) of tattling, then House knocks him down in the middle of the hallway. That poor kid looked like he was just about worn out by the end of the episode--kudos to JS for convincing me.

Tritter continues to be maddening--I'm used to that by now--but I actually found him a little bit sickening in the lunch scene. He's been very physically gentle with the Ducklings and Wilson, like he's attempting to comfort them a little bit despite what he's doing to them--like, "I'm sorry...but this is going to happen." But at the same time you can tell that he enjoys what he's doing to them, because it means he's winning, and there's this eerie feeling that just because he might feel sorry for you won't stop him from destroying you. The gentleness might just be an interrogation technique, I don't know. But those scenes really make my skin crawl, and Chase looked pretty revolted too.

And...at the end, when Chase said "I'm not waiting anymore," that didn't mean he decided to quit, did it? When I said in my Whack-a-Mole post that I wished they would explore how the dynamic between Chase and House has changed, I didn't really intend for them to end the dynamic between Chase and House. *worries*

I'd rather take that line as a revisitation of what Chase told House about his relationship with his dad in Cursed--"It hurts a lot less to just not care," "no disappointment." If he has decided "not to care" about House's approval anymore, it'll be interesting to see how that affects the diagnosis scenes. (No more "good ship A$$-Kisser?" ^^)

Poor Cuddy. Screw the employer/employee barrier; I wanted Wilson to give her a hug. I was proud of him for getting her laughing, though. That's the Wilson I love. :lol:

I was proud of the writers this time. House was being mean tonight, and I'm really glad that the other characters noticed and commented on that fact rather than everyone just acting like that's the way it's always been, or even that it's to be expected. Because it was out-of-character. That gives me hope that they're doing things for a reason and not just wandering around in the dark. :)

"I'm gonna need thirty pieces of silver"?? He's going to give Tritter that sort of ammunition to throw back in his face later when House finds out about this? <_<

I admire Wilson's motives...I think he really is doing this for House's own good (and everyone else's, I guess, if House is physically hurting people now). But I think it was a mistake to do it. At the beginning of the season he and Cuddy tried to force House's hand--they put him in a situation they thought would force him to admit his faults and change. But House is deeply angered when people make decisions for him, and I think he's justified because none of those decisions, all made with the best of motives, ever did what they were meant to do. (I don't count what happened in Detox because House made that choice--he accepted the bet. I think that's why he dealt with his pain more quietly and privately in Detox than he did tonight) House realized Chase was right after he hit him. HL's expression when this happened was perfect. He realized that he was wrong, and that this time he truly could not do his job without the Vicodin. He's used that before as a defense for taking the pills, but it looked to me like he really realized in that second what that meant, and that it made him uncomfortable. Unfortunately, Wilson didn't see this. For all we know, that one moment of epiphany might have made House go home and think about things--we didn't see House after that scene. But Wilson is trying so zealously to fix things, to actively force House to "change," that he's robbing House of the opportunity to come to that decision on his own. Because you know that as soon as House finds out about this, any stirrings of "maybe I don't like the way things are" he might have felt tonight will be completely overpowered by anger at Wilson for doing what's "good" for him without his knowledge or consent. Again. And honestly, I think I'm going to be right there with him.

But whatever. As long as we don't find Wilson dead in a field in the season finale. ;)

I'm about ready for the Tritter arc to end, I think, so I'm excited about next time. I want to hurry up and see this come to a climax; I'm wondering how it's going to turn out. Why are we skipping a week? If it's American Idol I'll be mad. :angry:

I liked this one a lot too. Actually it was interesting that House was actually about the only one who wasn't distracted by the outside issues tonight. He was the one that was calling everyone back to, "Yes, Tritter is making your life miserable, but, hello, sick, possibly dying kid, here. Let's focus". I really didn't see him as overly affected at that time. Yes, he missed a diagnosis. I guess we, and his staff, are supposed to question if this is all throwing him off his game. I suppose Chase sccoping House on the diagnosis is also supposed to lead us there, but ultimately I don't think that's really a sign that House is performing below par.

Wilson said it when he told Chase that he helped with a diagnosis and that's part of why he's there. Chase is also there to learn to do the same kinds of things that House does, although he may never have the exact gift that House does for it (I've argued that while many people assume Foreman is the most like House, it may be that Chase is really the one who shares the most with him, as well as being the best doctor out of the "ducklings" and the most suited to following in House's footsteps;granted House picks on him quite a lot, but then I'm told that teachers are often the hardest on the students they know have the most potential, especially when that student may not always be living up to said potential). After the three years the show has been on the air, as well as the additional time that Chase was with House before that--there's an exact amount mentioned in a part of the pilot that was later cut, but I don't remember what it is-- Chase would have to be a very poor student and doctor to not start getting things right every so often. And this has fulfilled another wish of many fans: an episode where one of the "ducklings" gets the diagnosis before House does. And House wasn't really detoxing this week, or at least not as much as he was during the episode with that title. He's on a lot less, it sounds like, than he's used to and he's hurting more and feeling the effects, but it's at least somewhat tapered so that it isn't the full blown threw-the-ringer-wanting-to-barf-jump-out-of-your-skin-and-die-all -at-the-same-time experience that cold turkey was. Now next week. . .

As far as House missing the diagnosis, we've may have never seen House miss a diagnosis in the end, but there is one case referenced that we did not get to see, Esther's, where House couldn't solve the puzzle in time to save the patient, and nearly didn't get it the second time he saw it either, not to mention the many missteps House makes on the way to a correct diagnosis. Had the surgery gone ahead it certainly would have been one of his more dramatic missteps, but then Alfredo, Cuddy's handyman, might not have had to lose as much of his hand or any at all had House and Co. solved that one sooner.

Yeah I didn't much care for either of the POTW's parents. It certainly happens in real life, and it bothers me just as much there, but look, you don't have to be best buddies or anything, you don't even have to like it, but for the sake of your child, suck it up, be adults, and work together/bury the hatchet for a little while. The kid may well be dying, try to get a grip. I was very glad when Cuddy told the parents to get out because they were freaking out their daughter.

Finally, we get to see "Mama Bear" Cuddy. Of course it would have been nice had that come out an episode or two ago--not that it would have helped, but it still would have been nice. Cuddy also came off as a much more competent physician although her awkwardness in certain parts of interacting with the POTW confirmed my theory that she's not a pediatrician, she's sort of good with the POTW, but she doesn't seem to have the kind of ease one would develop working with kids day in and day out.

And I feel for her on the Mom gene. I wonder if I have it as well. I'd like to have kids too if the circumstances align properly, but some people just seem to automatically interact with kids and I don't. I'm good at being the "fun one" (you need someone to make overly accurate animal noises during Old MacDonald's Farm--just don't ask for a giraffe because I have no clue--, or get on the floor and play trucks, I'm all over it), but at times when the brown and sticky his the fan the solution does not come to me naturally. Now from hearing stories from relatives and from friends who have kids I wonder if anyone really does know what they're doing with kids and that we should probably all be thankful that kids are really pretty resilient and most of the well intentioned mistakes we make will probably not scar them for life, but I still worry about how badly I would screw some poor innocent child up if I were responsible for raising them but at the same time would like to try anyway.

Then, fortunately no experience here, I suppose that while many people have a few miscarriages, often before they actually know there was anything to miscarry (one of the bummers, I understand of fertility treatment is that they're testing and watching all the time so that you get confirmation when most people would just be wondering, whereas the old fashioned way you were a bit late, but you don't know if it's just stress or if you were briefly pregnant), before things work out and that's natural, I suppose you wonder if this whole thing wouldn't have gone better if you'd done it back in your twenties, or even earlier in your thirties, like everyone said you were supposed to.<insert rant about the unfairness of biology that makes the peak time to work on one's career and the peak time to reproduce coincide for women>.

Glad to hear that Cuddy, at least, does know that House does have a good reason for the pills. Sometimes I was starting to wonder.

House's adventures with the laser pointer and the reference to unusual foreign bodies? Hah!

Let's see, what else?

I think what Tritter was saying was that the medical establishment hadn't done enough to encourage House to look for alternative methods of treatment, or to stop him before he got to the point that Tritter believes he's at now. In part it was an indictment of not managing House's pain, but it was more an indictment of not managing House.

Also, interesting that while Tritter has no way of knowing this (he doesn't see what we do, he only sees the arrogant, drug user and bully) Cameron is still doing the right thing. As does House most of the time. As someone who would probably do the same thing Cameron did in relation to her Calculus grade--had I the brain power to actually make it to Calculus in the first place-- I would also probably defend House: he's doing his job, he is not trafficking, and he does not seem to be impaired, or putting anyone at risk expect possibly himself. I don't think the "ducklings" know about the forged prescriptions, do they? If I were in Wilson's position, I'd probably feel I had to turn House in, but without that knowledge I wouldn't give Tritter anything. And even go further, that instead of naming a number of pills per day, I'd say "I didn't know I was in charge of his pill intake/some days more, some days less, because, you know pain varies".

Oh and I think in "Euphoria" we did find out that Foreman has a brother, possibly more than one, although we don't really find out anymore about them than that they do exist. I'm beginning to think that there must be more than one brother because I recall, Foreman asking is his brother was coming and his father telling him that he couldn't make it which sounded like the brother had a choice about whether or not to come when if he were in prison, he obviously wouldn't and Foreman probably wouldn't ask if he were coming either. Though I guess maybe the brother could have gotten arrested after that show in the timeline. So, as far as know about the brother it's yes and no I guess.

Also nice consistency that Foreman again mentions his background and the fact that he managed to turn into a productive, law abiding citizen when someone else from a similar background did not. The obvious difference between the brother and House, I wanted to point out though, was that House, despite his problems is doing something beneficial whereas as far as we know Foreman's brother was just using and/or selling drugs while presumably not otherwise really contributing to society.

I found it a bit creepy that Tritter seemed to know about Foreman's criminal past. I guess he could have found out the same way House did: asking around, but as Foreman said, once you become an adult your juvenile record is no longer accessible so there's no way Tritter could have found out via the usual channels. Then again he knows a creepy amount about the others too. More House parallels I guess. And it's true I guess that while we see Tritter as evil because he's up against House, who is the protagonist--I'll say again, not neccessarily the same as hero-- whereas, as someone on TWOP mentioned, if the show were Tritter, Princeton PD, and we'd spent three years getting a deeper look into his life, we'd totally be rooting for him to nail that scumbag, druggie doctor who had the audacity to mess with our guy in so intimate a fashion ie. the thermometer where the sun don't shine.

And oh the shock on House's face when it dawns on him that he just punched Chase, as well as that Chase might very well be right. I've been there, you just bottle it up and get so frustrated until you can't stand one more thing and lash out, verbally or physically, then immediately regret it because A. it's not really their fault and B. you didn't want to hurt the target anyway.

Well, there's my disorganized $.10 worth for now.

I'm adding on, Catlady... at first, House was on top of the game, but then when it got to mid-episode, we have House standing in the room with the patient (admittedly.. unconscious?) raving about how he needs more pills. I suppose the difference in tonight is that he involuntarily reduced the amount of vicodin he was using. This isn't Detox where he's getting something out of it. He's pissed and he's in pain. Sucks for him, heh?

It's funny how little attention I give the ducks sometimes. I "get" them... I just don't like them as much as, say, Cuddy, Wilson, and House. I totally feel Cuddy's awkwardness when she was alone with the kid... the only kid I ever "babysat" was my sister (3 years younger). I suck with kids and I think I signed a hand-written contract when I was 10 (after being goaded by my parents and brother) that I would never have kids. So far so good. I should have put $$ on that.
Oh- the ducks. They're right about some of the tests sometimes- what to do, what the next path should be.. but they really never do get the diagnosis, do they? Go Chase. I always had faith in you buddy.

Actually, it depends on the jurisdiction and the case and badges certainly help in that regard. Court orders can be obtained for those records if necessary... especially if it is pertinant to the investigation (which, to me, doesn't seem to be the case for Foreman). And then there is good ole fashioned beating the street... asking around (like House). Tritter has certainly turned into an asshole. I almost hope he gets a little nicer (?) next episode (2 WEEKS???!!)

Oh man, so much going on in this episode. I'm not going to go into huge lengthy detail, since most of you have covered the bases already, but I do have a few things to say.

House was not just "out of control" in this episode. He was not nearly as "out of control" in the Detox story arc despite not having his pills there either. The difference here is that this time, despite his constant insisting that Tritter is just a big bully who will slither off if ignored long enough, he's totally running scared in this one. Tritter has threatened the two things that makes his life livable - his job and his drugs.

And despite all his outward confidence that it will blow over, you can tell he's crumbling to pieces inside - he can't concentrate on the case because he's preoccupied with the pills and the looming threat, and we're clearly meant to see that this is why he missed the diagnosis. What's more telling is that he didn't even seem to give a damn, and in fact was obviously quite hostile to the bearer of bad news, so to speak. As much as Chase annoys me, I genuinely felt bad for the poor little floppy-haired rat.

Speaking of rats, I was not even remotely surprised by Wilson squealing on House. And despite what someone mentioned above, I don't think it has anything to do with wanting what's best for House. I think in this case Wilson's been pushed too far, being shoved out of his practice and getting what he feels as a 100% lack of support from someone who's supposed to be his best friend. They seemed to be back on speaking terms at least in this episode for whatever reason (and some fanfiction writer definitely needs to write in that missing scene) but you can tell he blames House mostly if not entirely for his situation, not Tritter as House believes he should. I think Wilson himself feels betrayed already because of House forging the prescriptions with his pad, which is likely why he can justifiy doing this. I loved the "I'll need 30 pieces of silver" line. Maybe if the slashers are lucky, we'll see the judas-kiss on the lips between the two of them, LOL.

Tritter - now I still don't like the character because he's mucking up my Housey-poo's life, but I'm starting to see where he's coming from on this. I think he's gone after a fly with a sledgehammer but in some ways he's correct about Cuddy et al. failing to do anything to help House. But in a lot of other ways, I think Tritter is totally barking up the wrong tree because in some cases there just isn't a good solution and I think as a cop and being indoctrinated into the "war on drugs" he doesn't realize that sometimes there really is no other way and that maybe perhaps all other avenues have been exhausted. We're quite obviously supposed to notice the similarities between Tritter and House and in that scene with Cuddy their attitudes toward their work was errily similar - no family or social interests, obsessive pursuit at all costs, being a bastard to people to get results - well if the writers were trying to get us to see it, I think they've sufficiently beaten us over the head with it. Of course Tritter is NOT House because he's all of House's bad qualities x10 with NONE of the good. He's like the uber-evil Twin to House's diet-coke-of-evil Twin.

As for Cuddy, I also felt sorry for her. She didn't deserve the bite she got from House. You could tell she was trying her best not to take it personally, because out of all of the characters, I think she alone realizes just how scared shitless House is at the moment. Despite House's nasty jab, I think she'd make an excellent mother, given a chance.

And that's about all I've got to say. Okay, so it was windier than I'd thought. :P

So . . . poor, poor everybody, in this episode (thanks to Tritter, some of them literally . . . rimshot).

I could not effing believe what those parents were saying about their daughter in front of her . . . I mean, it's not like my parents never fought, but they never said anything about preferring me dead, or whatever it was the mom said. And the dad's right; kids that age don't understand sarcasm. No wonder she was so freaked out.

Poor Cuddy. House definitely knows how to go for the throat.

Me too. Very very.

I hope not. Things are getting interesting, and they finally gave him more to do than reaction shots. And even House sorta went "Woah. What the hell?" at least, mentally. I'm reminded of the time he dream-punched Wilson in last season's finale.

I think Wilson noticed the bruise on Chase's chin when they were making sandwiches. Maybe that and Chase's line about not waiting helping tip the scale into talking to Tritter.

Yes. You hear that, Fox? Please don't take the metaphor quite that far . . .

I think "diet-coke-of-evil" will be my new catchphrase ;)

And did anyone else feel the sudden need for PB&J after this ep? I went and made myself a sandwich. :D

Like you all have said, love it, andso much going on.

I too am confused as to what Chase's end line meant. I must rewatch tonight and see if I get any new insights.

Now, on to Wilson.

I think Wilson is acting not only out of his need to "do what's right for House" but I really felt something needed to be done.

After finding Cuddy in tears and hearing what happened from her and seeing the bruise on Chases chin he finlly realized that it's not all about House. That House is out of control for real this time and he has already hurt people. He almost crippled the little girl (although I don't think we saw it but I would think Wilson knew about the surgery) and like someone else said above, even though House was trying to maybe prove he could still do his job he waht ranting about getting more pills in a patients room!

I never got the impression Wilson was just trying to free himself up so to speak. He also knows damn well, as Stacy did, that House will probably never forgive him for this. That this is a move to save his life, not just do what is right for him. But primarily I think it's to also save those around House.

Wilson realizes that Tritter is not going to give up and House is never going to give in. That combination and what Wilson saw happening this episode indicates that House will take everything else with him if he has to, just so he doesn't have to admit he's wrong. Wilson wasn't going to stand by and let that happen. He may have if it had just been him (as it had been up to this point) but when it moved to everyone else Wilson stepped up. Good for him!

Than again it could just be that he felt Chase was going to relly sell out House and from the preview for next week it seems Wilson work out an option that will allow House to keep his license and his job where as maybe he felt Chase would put House behind bars.

Either way I think he wanted House to come to the conclusion on his own but felt that he was out of time and something needed to be done now.

Poor transition from me, but Cuddy was fantastic tonight! Thank you to whoever wrote this episode!! From her scenes with Tritter to her scenes with House, the PotW, and finally With Wilson in her office. Just fantastic writing and amazing acting!!! Damn, just so much talent on this show!

I don't know if I can wait two weeks. And from what I understand we won't get resolution to the Tritter arc until after the New Year. :blink: :angry: :(

And yes Lily, it better not be becasue of American Idol (do we have a puking smilie?)

I'm kinda glad it's gonna be two weeks, since my dad is coming into town and we're suppose to go to dinner Tuesday. So I won't be cramped for time and can enjoy dinner and not worry about getting back in time for House. In other time I'd be piss.

Reminds me of an old physicist's joke - "What happens when an unstoppable force and an immovable object collide?"

Answer: "All hell breaks loose"

I think that about sums up Tritter vs House. I can't see this ending well for House, and I think anything at this point is just damage control.

Yes, rtlemurs, I think you nailed Wilson's motivations. He realizes that neither House nor Tritter will give in, he sees that other people are being hurt in the process, and he fears that Chase will sell out House anyway. So, he breaks the impasse and, from the scenes for next episode, tries to barter a reasonable deal with Tritter that will help House keep his license. House will view it as a betrayal, but I don't know if he really has a right to: it was Wilson's signature he forged, so House is the one who got Wilson involved in the whole mess.

Chase rocked in this episode! He was totally channeling House with the final diagnosis: he was playing with House's toy, then an offhand seemingly unrelated comment ("sunshine and puppies") inspired him to realize in a flash what was up, and he was able to explain how this diagnosis ties together everything. It was beautiful. I was so proud. And I think House would be proud too, were he in a better psychological state.

In the "Whack-a-Mole" episode thread, Shadowself(sp?) noted a subtle reference to "Detox". The House-decking-Chase scene was also reminiscent of "Detox". In that episode, House gets decked by the patient's Dad for stopping his son's surgery, and explains his rationale while sitting on the floor. Here, Chase gets decked by House for trying to stop the patient's surgery, and explains his rationale from the floor. As others have noted, House is acting even more crazed in this episode than in "Detox", which makes sense. Although he's getting some drugs here, his control over his drugs has been removed. At least in "Detox" it was up to him whether he stuck it out to win the bet. House copes with loss of control even worse than he copes with loss of Vicodin.

I'm torn about the "American Idol" thing. I don't like the show, but having AI as a lead-in may have boosted House's popularity enough to keep it on the air. An there was that great commercial featuring snarking by both House and Simon Cowel . . . So, I don't want ANYTHING bumping "House" off the schedule, but if it has to be bumped by something, maybe AI is the least bad cause :-)

I went to the fox site, and it said that there was going to be an encore broadcast. Next week so there will be House, just not a new episode. I'm sort of hoping AI has been canceled. Isn't there something where AI doesn't air until January. I'm sure they're doing this just to build suspense. They'll be repeating 3 stories.

Some how, the song "That was a Crazy Game of Poker"- OAR fits this arc so well. Maybe it's just me.

Okay, now they're just playing ith us like a cat with a wounded mouse! :angry:

But I'll take "Three Stories". Maybe I'll go visit my sister and get her addicted. RIght now she's watch two episodes. The pilot and one other and she just doesn't like House. Maybe this one will change her mind.

:D Oh yeah, and that is exactly where we are headed. I'm very curious as to what House is doing in the stairwell sitting on what looks like the middle of the steps, (just down from a landing so he had to either have already come down a flight or climbed up) cane on the step behind, in the preview clip. (Damn, they better not be stealing another scene from my fic! They already swiped the pacing around the apartment scene.Of course they can't, it hasn't been posted yet but that's just weird! I gotta write faster :D )

Link to the lovely screencap described above Kudos to marykir and her wonderful clip site for the screencap! You rock lady!

That was cool. That out-of-the-blue inspiration scene I mean. So very, very House-like. And I'm going to say it here that I don't think Chase was going to run to Tritter. I just think that everyone else thought he had or would.

And that is an interesting parallel. Also, both punches were thrown in defense of a bad decision. The father wanting an unnessecay surgey and House wanting an unnessesary surgery. It is interesting that there seem to be parallels. Are they trying to tll us something or is is just coincidence. And by coincidence I mean that both times he has been detoxing (to a smaller degree in this episode) and that it's not nessecarily the detox that's the problem but the loss of control, as you've pointed out.

More or less that House can live with, set his mind to and accomplish things as long as they are his decision and in his control but as soon as he loses that he won't budge until he has it back. But is he really such a control freak? That just doesn't seem to fit for me and maybe that's just the picture I'd like to see.

Yes, he likes to be in control, revels in it in fact but he has always been open to others suggestions an ideas if they had valid grounds. But that has only been in a professional capacity. Maybe the leg does play a part in this in that he gave control over his person and his personal decisions at least once and look where it landed him. I can see that he'd be very unwilling to relinquish that control again.

Gah!! :blink: Way too much to think about!

ANd yes, I appreciate what American Idol did for House more than I could express but I feel that show is tired now. I can't see that they can do anything different and their only route to spice it up now and make it fresh and intersting once again is going to have to be contrived and I hate contrived! Plus, I never cared for all that "Reality TV" crud anyhow.

Lemurs broke the board. :(

Why is it that whenever somebody posts a picture that stretches the board larger than the screen size, this messageboard flat-out refuses to give you a lateral scroll bar and let you read the whole thing? <_<

thank heavens for adblocking images...

Yes but the picture was worth it :D

Apologies for typos; I made the text itty bity so I could read everyone's thoughts.

Good point; I hadn't thought of that. Maybe another way that the writers are trying to show that Chase has potential beyond what most people assume. Someone earlier in the thread compared him to House. (Though the writers also seem to be pushing for Foreman for HouseTrek: The Next Generation, what with the matching shoes and so forth.)

:( Sorry guys, I didn't have time to crop so I changed it to a link for the curious.

I need to make a new banner from that when I get home! Either that or study for my marketing test that I need to get B on to pass the course. Hmmmm that's a tough one :D

REALLY fast, but

1. this episode rocked, rocked, rocked

2. It alluded heavily not only to "Detox" (tpel, I was all over that punch scene too) but to "Heavy": cute little girl faces amputation due to horrific spreading rash (possibly caused by the treatment); House is in trouble and Chase is suspected of being a traitor; Chase also comes up with idea that unlocks the case; entire team preoccupied with outside circumstances and House has to keep reminding them to concentrate on the patient.

3. I think the squabbling parents also paralleled House and Cuddy. Down to the hairstyles!

"It's always Lupus." I laughed so hard.

Yeah, House was way, way out of control in this one. He reminded me of a little kid throwing a temper tantrum when he didn't get his way.

My respect for Chase went up a bit in this one. Getting socked like that and then, still on the ground, explaining to House what he thought was going on took guts.

I think Tritter is giving House what he deserves. He's been getting worse and worse this season, and he needs either an ego-check or something. I don't agree with how Tritter is doing it (who ever said it was like he was going after a fly with a mallet was right), but House needs it.

I thought the line was, "It's never Lupus" maybe I heard wrong.

And my typing skills still suck. You're right. I still laughed so hard.

Sledgehammer. Not mallet. Sledgehammer. ;)

Yeah, the Lupus thing was funny. As was Cuddy's assumption that House has a secret stash and a secret secret stash.

AI could have Hugh Laurie be a guest judge for an episode! OK, I know, it's a dumb idea. But it could be funny. As himself, I would imagine HL would be fairly kind to the contestants. As House, not so much. And then they could get Simon to do a fake American accent and see if that makes him behave any nicer to the contestants . . .

Silly? Yes. Contrived? Yes. But hey, Hugh Laurie . . . :-)

Its interesting because I have never had a problem with anything House has done, said or anything else to date but this ep I did.

Not, ironically, because of his lower than low crack at Cuddy who I adore or because of Wilson's predicament. Punching Chase was out of character and out oif control. House's bitch at Cuddy was spiteful and dreadful but I do think Cuddy and Wilson do have an involement and have both, at times, treated House fairly cruelly. I'm not being all 'Poor House' but the waters are slightly more muddy than with Chase. That was bang out of order and I can't wait to see where this goes and how House and Wilson survive this schism.

However I was pissed off with one thing - why, oh WHY did Foreman's brother have to be in nick?????? Wilson is the one with the missing, balck sheep brother and yet it seemed so contrived that all of a sudden Foreman has a outcast sibling?? Foreman has a 'mean streets learned me the hard way' written through him like a stick of rock - we saw it again with his mother issues - so why??? This heightens my worry that a fabulous storyline potential in Wilson's bro will never be explored. Rant over but gah that did cheese me off.

Maybe Wilson's brother and Foreman's brother are the same person . . . . duh duh dunnnnnnnnnn!

Nah, that's way too soap opera. Or X-files. Or something.

I'm betting House's secret secret secret stash is in the Sarcoidosis (sp) book, because it's never that disease either :P

After a random comment on another board prompted me to rewatch this episode, a new thought has occured to me.

When Tritter was talking to Cuddy about how the hospital, all the folks around House and more specifically she had failed House, the first impression was he's trying to seem sympathetic to House's cause and get her to trust him and open up. Quite possibly playing the guilt card. I'm sure he knows her involvement in House's disability and surmised that she must carry a lot of guilty from that to put up with the all she does from House.

But, on the rewatch I got to thinking was he trying to piss her off. Place the blame of all House's problems on her. And by doing so anger her enough that she would slip up and say something along the lines of "it's not my fault the man takes too many pills, we've tried and just refuses to do anything about it!"

I'm almost positive that Tritter knows what happened to House's leg at this point and that Cuddy was his doctor. Maybe even sounded some other hospital personel and found that House is fond of poking a stick at her lack of doctoring abilities (even though I don't think House believes that and only uses it to prompt her to do something). Maybe Tritter figures if he pokes that tender spot he just might get a reaction out of her. House obviously does so why not try it?

Is he sly enough to calculate that scenario knowing that either way she responded, sympathetic or angry, would quite possibly give him what he needed?

I mean I think at this point Tritter has wised up to the fact that as unlikeable as he finds House, these folks do like him or at least respect him and will protect him. I think he has come to realize that there may be some redeeming qualities to House after all and that burying him may not be the answer.

That House is worth 'saving' and this interaction with Cuddy may have shown him that.

I guess I'm just hoping that Tritter isn't that big of a b*st*rd and that, like House he can be unrelenting in his pursuit but always has room for a shift or a change of direction if the facts support it. That it's about truth and not emotions. That as pissed off as he is and no matter how much he wants revenge, Tritter can put that on hold and do what is right becasue that is what he's about. Am I making sense here?

From the previews we know that a deal was struck so that tells me Tritter knows there's more than meets the eye when it comes to House. If he didn't understand that he would never have made a deal. He'd have kept on squeezing until he had House behind bars.

Anyhow, just a thought. What do you all think?

I guess my issue with Tritter is that he is such a one trick pony and I like your scenario a lot, RT.

Basically its way too much of a stretch to believe that all this came out of House sticking the guy with a thermometer. If he’d been delving into the shooting or asked to investigate by the DEA or some other contrivance it would have worked. The way it was unfolded so far does not convince me the guy has motive to digging out Cameron’s college record or Foreman’s brother. With Vogler I bought into it – partially because there was a humorous tone to it and also because the spiral toward hating House was a bi-product of his buying into the hospital. He had motive for wanting control but Tritter? Its and I would buy it much better if he did have some back-story or reason to care this much.

I thought this episode was pretty good. I figured that Wilson was 'Judas'. You could fee3l the tension between House and Wilson when Wilson was making his sandwhich..great acting on Hugh and RSL's part :)

I liked the argument between Cuddy and Tritter, both justifying House' drug use, both had good points. I still can't stand Tritter though, even though he's doing his job.

I didn't like that House was that intentionally mean to Cuddy :( :angry: I can understand House going through detox and how painful that is but I think tonight he did it intentionally because he knew it would hurt her, which jusr sucks! But I think the writers etc. did a great job portraying this.

I liked the comforting scene between Cuddy and Wilson, very sweet :)

God and peace
Vanessa :)

That's an interesting thought, rtlemurs. After his over-the-top persecution of House, why would Tritter be willing to make a reasonably benign deal? Maybe Tritter thinks agreeing to rehab would be more humiliating for House than going to jail. Tritter is out to humble House, not necessarily to destroy his career.

I agree..I think that making House do rehab is much more humilating than loosing his career or going to jail. Plus I think House is too wrapped up in his job to want to loose it. JMHO.

God and peace
Vanessa :)

Coming way late to the party on this one, so just a few thoughts:

I think Cuddy and Wilson could be handling this better. Yes, House brought all of this upon himself. Doesn't look like he's going to get out of it on his own, either. IMO Cuddy's thing with the drugs was the straw that broke the camel's back - there has to be a reason he didn't catch this one.

I'm not so sure about the whole rehab thing. I mean, are we talking live-in? A therapy-circle-group once a week? Some sort of program? Whatever it is, I don't think House will enjoy it. It's even possible that TPTB will use it as a catalyst for major change in the character. That's what I'm not sure about.

I'm thinking that's probably one of the cardinal differences between House and Tritter. House will relentlessly pursue what is right. If it changes, if he gets new information, he turns around. We saw this in Autopsy. From what we've seen of Tritter, he relentlessly pursues what is right until he drives himself into the ground or destroys something. Sitting in a dusty old store room on his week off? Why not boating or shooting or fishing or other cop stuff? He's like House in that all he can think about is the puzzle, the solution he has his mind set on. But he's more concrete than House, because he can't even consider stopping, even when different information presents itself. House is the impartial sarcastic presence, Tritter is right in the middle of it.

AH, but I think it was more than that. I think it started with nicotine withdrawl. I've heard that can be pretty rough and with all the nicotine gum Tritter is chewing he's not having an easy time of it.

Add to the the "cop mentality". I've known a lot of cops and they all have at least a pinch of that attitude, some have an overload. That "I'm that good guy out here putting my life on the line for you so you should respect me" thing. Tritter's go it in spades.

Next, Tritter is a detective. his job is looking not only at the evidence but being able to read people. To not only see that things don't add up but to read body language and listen to how things are said to determine guilt or at least suspicion of guilt. Tritter's got to be tuned to that to do his job well.

So he goes to the clinic and gets disrespected by House even before the thermometer. He knows right off that there's something going on with this guy that isn't right. I really think that even without the thermometer incident he would have done some checking on House.

That thermometer just made it a little more personal for him. Made him more determined to get House. I think it is a combination of what Tritter sees as doing the right thing and wanting a little revenge for himself. It may have started as a revenge mission but I just don't feel that his prime motivator now is revenge. I really believe he believes he is doing the right thing and maybe saving a life or two. He really believes House will kill someone if left uncheck.

I think it was just a cascading event. It started as one thing and has evolved into another. I feel Tritter's purpose moved past revenge and that's why he is pursuing this so hard. It's what he does. If he can get revenge and humiliate a bully in the process so much the better.

At least that's the way I see it but it may just be that I'm seeing it because I've been told that's what they were trying to accomplish. (interviews with David Morse, Hugh and David Shore).

The only thing I find suspicious in this whole arc is the amount of pills found at House's apartment. I found that to be very, very unbelievable. even if he wrote every perscription on Wilsons pad how the ehck would he get them all filled in that short a period with out setting off bells and whistles across the state? And I don't believe the explaination that they were most of them could have been leftovers from before the ketamine.

I can see him hording some pills now but I think TPTB went a little overboard there or were the insinuationg that maybe Tritter planted some?

I think you've got a great point there. Tritter still wants to humiliate House. If he can accomplish his job and humilate the bully in the process it's icing on the cake. House is an arrogant SOB that won't admit he has a problem, what better way to humiliate him?

So, is it all about the humiliation or does Tritter see some redeeming qualities in House? Is he willing to just humiliate a drug addicted, loose canon doctor because he wants to humiliate him or does he want to solve the problem?

I believe he does want to solve the problem. He see that House is The Man at PPTH. That he does have a unique and rare gift that is a benefit to society and should be kept in play so to speak. But Tritter also sees that House has drug issues that need to be addressed and not only House, but no one else around House seems willing to do anything about it. By making that deal he not only does what is right but gets a little revenge too. For Tritter it's a win-win and I think he believes that for House it's a win-win too. Even though House won't see it that way.

Let me also say here that I don't approve of Tritter's technique in squeezing everyone else around House. I know why he did it but I think it's cowardly. that's where the character lost my respect.

Not sure what you mean here. Are you saying that Cuddy should have realized that her rationing House's pain meds was the reason House didn't get the diagnosis? Or that this was why House made the jab at her mothering skills?

I have a feeling it'll be great to watch and may, if it happens, reduce House's pill intake back to 'perscribed limits'. I think it was late season one or early season two when it was mentioned House was taking double what he had been when Cuddy first hired him. He is way over what is normal and, as far as we and everyone else has seen, he is unwilling to do anything or try anything else. He wants Vicodin, period.

I think this will also lead to a closer examination of the "What is normal?" question that has already been brought up. This show has, in my mind, done an excellent job in examining the whole addiction/chronic pain issue. I think it has even been brought up here that many times mismanaged pain can exhibit as addiction when it is not addiction.

Does House really need all those pills? Yes, he is experiencing real pain and does need pain relief not only to do his job, but just to function some days. But how much does he really need? Are there alternative that he is unwilling to try that may bring better, more permanate relief? Why is he so unwilling to try these things? Has he already, on his own, and found them lacking? Or does he just want the pills?

Plus, a reduction in his Vicodin intake will ward off the already raised question of liver damage and impending liver failure. You just can't take as much as House is supposed to be taking over the period of time he has been taking it an not have any ill effects. I don't know the limits but I'm sure eight years of steadily increasing dosage has to have consequences.

But, I don't think we have to worry about TPTB taking House's pills away or curing him of his addictions. The worst we may see is like after the shooting. A confused, questioning, temporarily low dosage House but I'd put money on a quick relapse if that happens.

I think it's an excellent way and somewhat realistic way to examine the issue. But then again, we'll see. I've trusted the writers and the actors for two and a half seasons and they have not disappointed me yet!

I still don't see the logic - and if the guy is House but a badass cop then why is he not logical. So the guy stuck a thermometer up his arse??? He was rude?? Well Tritter was although those things and had a worse attitiude to House in that clinic room meet'n'greet before House snarked and it all kicked off. Nicotine withdrawal isn't pleasant but it doesn't merit this kind of reaction and I still find it way OTT. Which makes it difficult to appreciate how he is 'doing to House waht he does to others' because (this week excepted) House isn't pointlessly evil or a bully. If anyone can show how he is either of those things then I'll be amazed. He's been cruel in his method but rarely in his motive and even his get back at Von Evil cause him far more pain than anyone else.

The shooter I bought - something so serious over someone close would be motive to go after House but Tritter? Take the thermometer out of your arse, mate ,and get over it!!!

Nice discussion though RT - I remain 'to be convinced'.

I don't have trouble accepting that the thermometer incident was the catalyst for Tritter's vendetta, Benj. But that's probably because I pegged Tritter as deeply scarey in the very first scene, even before the thermometer. Tritter cannot tolerate being slighted. Of course, once he became engaged in his vendetta, he found other reasons to want to get House, and these reasons may eventually trump his initial motivation.

The part of the story arc that I have trouble suspending disbelief over is how far Tritter seems able to go without being checked. Having Wilson's car towed is one thing -- he just needs to have a friend (or someone who fears him) on parking patrol who is willing to do it. But freezing the accounts of people who are not directly involved (Foreman, Cameron) and pulling doctors' DEA clearance? That's hard to swallow.

It helps me to think of Tritter not as a real-life cop but as a TV cop. Aren't they always obsessively out to get their man? Working 24/7, bending the rules when necessary? Of course, most of the time, the TV cops are the good guys, and "their man" is some evil scumbag. This time "the man" is House . . .

. . . which makes me think of House's line "Who da man? I da man. I always suspected" . . . which is totally irrelevant to this discussion, but makes me laugh . . . :-)

House can barely function. He's too busy dealing with the pain and the impending detox. It wasn't entirely Cuddy's fault that he 'missed one', but she is partially responsible. As for the jab, well, House can be a callous bastard and it seems Cuddy was at the recieving end this time, for no reason. A really low blow, but it could have been anyone: He's basically out of control, in big trouble and unsupported.

Very interesting points there. I was thinking more along the lines of a regression to the post-infarction House - I'm talking immediately post-infarction. This is complete conjecture, though.


House in this episode does some pretty inexcusable things. What I think is interesting is that the audience still (partially, at least) empathises with him. He's completely miserable and probably hating himself just as much as everyone else.


I think the thing with the thermometer was all it took for Tritter to turn the Vendetta Knob up to 11, to change his idle investigation into serious revenge/retribution seeking. I think your situation is quite plausible as well, Rt - Tritter knows all about House's habits, where Wilson lives, the history of the ducklings, so I don't think it's that much of a stretch to think that he's well versed in House's history as well.

It's interesting that Tritter tripped House after a thirty-second clinic consultation. He'd done his homework. He knew House used a cane, and he'd probably observed just how he walked. Is it that much of a stretch to assume that he also thought House wouldn't be able to hold back retaliation if he tripped him over? He seems like enough of a cold, calculating creep to play that game.

I know the first question wasn't addressed at me, but I want to answer it anyway, so I will. :P I think the attack on Cuddy is meant to demonstrate House's mental state and his desperation. As Cuddy says, while House is capable of being mean and saying incredibly mean things, for the most part he's not mean just to be mean. As I posited before, House probably only says about half the things he comes up with. In a more normal situation, the whole remark about Cuddy's unfitness as a mother might pop into his head as a way to really get to her, but he'd consider that it really does hit a bit too close to home and that saying it won't really get him anything he needs. But in this episode being frustrated with the impact Tritter's had on his life and day to day routine, combined with frustration about the case, then add in the fact that he's really not feeling well because of the beginnings of withdrawl, and this time, he decides to "share the joy", so to speak and just say it. It's all too much, Cuddy, and everyone else, is really hurting him, so he lashes out and hurts just as badly (well maybe worse, but his reasoning when he said it probably was that they were even on the pain scale).

Now on the post rehab state. Yeah, we're definitely going to see House in a lot more pain. It would be nice if they put him on a different medication eventually that was more effective, most of the time, or at least knocked things back to around season one, or pre-season one even, levels. I don't know that they can. Previous discussions have been held on why they chose Vicodin in the first place when it's really not that effective for the kind of pain House is experiencing, but it sort of boiled down to the fact that your average lay person knows Vicodin is a narcotic pain medicine and something with the potential for addiction, whereas other more appropriate but less recognized-by-the-public medicines would leave viewer wondering what the pills were for and about other implications of House taking them. Obviously if you've watched as long as most of us have, you know all you need to, but they've got to keep it simple for the new viewers that we have to hope they keep attracting.

And as much as people may complain that we've gone through all this and House is the same, relapse is a very realistic end result. Very rarely does rehab take the first time in real life, even for people who do eventually wind up staying clean. The success rate is even less for people who aren't entirely committed to staying clean. Granted, we don't know what House's state of mind will be at the end of the next episode-- I suppose it's possible that he'll have an epiphany and decide he really does have a problem that needs taking care of-- but at least for now it seems that House will go to rehab because it's the lesser of two evils (prison or rehab) and to get everyone off his back, not because he really wants to change.

I've seen it with the cousin I've mentioned before with the long running alcohol, and it turns out, drug problem (what he's on, how much, and when, who knows). He's had the nagging from family and has tried it a few times for them. It didn't take. He's also had some pretty close calls (several DUI convictions, a couple of scary accidents leading to a few of those convictions, accidentally starting a fire in his parents' house), these really shook him up, he thought he really had the motivation to do it this time, and has managed to make it stick for a while,-- once he even ran into a now sober buddy at an AA meeting, which seemed a good sign as this guy was further into his recovery and promised to help support this cousin-- but ultimately, still hasn't worked. On the other hand I have a relative on the other side of the family, who due to a really strong, spiritual experience, just flat out decided he was through drinking, despite past failed attempts, and didn't have another drink thereafter and did it complete on his own.

Then with House you have an added complication: he does need medication. In other situations you can decide you're never doing it again and you don't eg if you're an alcoholic you know that if you take another drink, even one, you'll wind up doing the same thing over again, so you just don't drink and to some extent avoid situations that will tempt you to do so. House has to take some kind of medication so he can't just avoid what got him in trouble in the first place in quite the same way.

As for programs, I imagine it's going to have to be a semi-outpatient thing, or else I guess we have another magical time skip like we did after the shooting--though in that case real time elapsed along with show time, whereas if I understand spoilers this time House has a patient again in the next episode. And there are programs like that, or programs where you stay in for about a week to initially detox and get started on recovery, but then you go back to your life and just come back for meetings/checkups afterwards for some time.