For those interested, Nadal and Moya are up one set to love -6-4.
Wawrinka having a slightly tough time, but Rafa and Rog had some nice little rallies.

Some great touches now, Federer just produced some lovely vollies and all four players getting really involved.
Fedwrinka relying on Rogers genius, but Los Gemelos in their matching Nike, may prove too tough a combination...

Where are you watching this?

It's on Sky Sports Extra.

Federer just produced a shot that defied belief-had everyone just laughing it was so good. That said, Nadal has just answered back with some more sublime shots.

Commentators are saying that Fed and Nadal are acting as "brothers in arms" to promote doubles at the moment, in light of their recent "conflicts" with Etienne.

Scores are 2-2 in second set.

Unbelievable. If doubles needs promoting - these two are the players to do it.

Fedwrinka lead 3-2 in the second set.

Los Gemelos will be wanting to break back here, but Fedwrinka have really got back into this. Wawrinka is looking more confident now, especially on serve.

Fedwrinka up 4-2 in the second set. This is really impressive tennis from all involved. Nadals placement on vollies has been impeccable, and Feds net shots unbelievable.

I would really love to see that Fed - Nadal doubles team that Rafa was suggesting last year. I guess it's not likely --- but who knows, stranger things have happened.

4-3 in the second set. Los Gemelos still a break down, but nothing to be read into that...

Yes, a Fed-Rafa doubles team would be incredible. I think it would be a few years down the line, but as you say-you never know! I'd love to witness that match!

Looks like the Swiss team was just broken. :(

Whose serve was it? And whose were the other two breaks of serve in this match?

Please do say if no one is interested in the scores!

Los Gemelos have broken back - it currently stands at 4-4.

Fed was serving in the last game - a few errors from him

However, break point again against Nadals serve!

I've got to say the Moya Nadal "outfits" are truly mind bogglingly bizarre.

I'm certainly interested in hearing more about this match, I'm just following the scores --- though I'll have to go out for a few minutes now. :(

Did I get it right that it was Fed's and Nadal's serves that were broken in this set?

Ooh, and Rafa was broken again. Rogislas leading 5-4, with Stan about to serve for the set, and force the match tie-break. :pray:

5-4 to los gemelos...

I thought it was 5-4 to the Swiss?

Doesn't matter now anyway ... they've been broken back :(

5-5. Moya to serve, if I'm not mistaken?

6-5 to Los Gemelos.

Both serves broken-it's been thrilling stuff. I've been really impressed with Nadals volleys - not the power, the placement. And, of course, Rogs net play.

Moya has been solid and impressive as always, Wawrinka took some time to warm up.

I'll add some of the commentators comments. Barry Cowan has a lot to say - I can't help but always think of poor Cowan as a pawn in the Weak/Strong Era debate :D

Fed delivers, holding his serve to force the tie-break. :phew:

1-0 in the tie-break. Now Wawrinka's two serves, is that right?

Did Stan lose his nerve?

3-0 to the Spaniards. :(

4-1; one mini-break pulled back. Now Fed needs to get both his serves through.

5-2. :( Looks like the end of the road for the Swiss.

5-4. All of a sudden, we're back on serve in the tie-break. However, now Wawrinka needs to hold his nerve. :pray:

6-5. MP. :(

GSM Rafos. 6-4 7-6 (5)

Sorry - missed that last bit! Match point taken by Los G, taken well.

Fedwrinka lost it in the tie break. Los G on clay were unbeatable.

Commentators saying Nadal is the King again, and that he wanted the match more than the other three (?!)

Is Nadal any good at Volleying? :huh:

Peter Fleming saying Nadals will won that match, and from the first point he was out there to win.

When Nadal walks on the court, he will wants to win - his indominable will sees him through. If the ground were to open up, he'd still want to shake hands as a winner.

Guy asking Fleming questions is talking rot, generally.

Fleming now saying he doesn't think Nadal will ever lose this will power. May have an effect on him down the road, but who knows.

Big discussions on how alert Nadal was throughout the match.

volleying and Nadal - he had the agility and interpretation...today he had the precision (I think, husband disagrees with me on this!)

Has anyone notice how empty hewitts match is, it disturbing. roflmao roflmao roflmao roflmao

Poor Fed... he just can't beat Rafa on clay can he?

Re: Nadal's volleys, he's actually a very good volleyer - one of the best on the tour. No-one ever seems to notice this; probably because it's quite rare that he goes to the net. But anyone who watched his matches at Queens and Wimbledon last year really should know how proficient his volleying is. Take a look at the Verdasco match at the Stella Artois, or the 3rd set tie-break in the Wimbledon final. His placement is superb on the forehand volley and the backhand is more than reliable. Admittedly he hasn't yet learnt to power the volley, but frankly, with the quality of his placement that's not essential. I'd love to see him coming to the net more regularly at Wimbledon this year, albeit only if he times it sensibly (take note Roddick). He could easily repeat his success of last year if he does.

I very rarely watch doubles, but Nadal seems to have a decent record there, which is testament to his ability at the net.

Nadals only volley appears to be when someone belts at him and he blocks it back with a winning stop volley - which he did on numerous occasions today. Good anticipation from him.

What he has never done yet, or I haven't seen, is him take a difficult return -be it low or something out of comfortable reach and then put that volley in an area that takes real guile and skill.

Nadal is improving in this area, but he's not a Henman, Sampras or Federer - he's more a block volleyer. Though did see some precision today.

Please don't compare Federer's volleying to that of Sampras and Henman!

I'd put Nadal's volleying in the same league as Federer's (i.e below the league of the two above), and I'd rate him higher if he did it more often. Federer often only comes into the net when he's hit an an excellent approach shot and therefore he often has an easy put away. In that Verdasco match I mentioned, I saw Nadal produce some truly phenomenal volleys from the shoelaces. He definitely prefers the stop volley as you say, but the fact is that that's a much harder volley than the traditional sweep stroke into the corners, so I see no reason why he'd struggle with that if he wanted to play it.

Precisely. That's exactly my point, his volleying is somewhat one dimensional at moment.
Also, on clay, he doesn't need to use the volley - his groundstrokes are unstoppable!

With regard to Federer, we've all seen his breadth of volleying. True he doesn't come into the net as much, but he doesn't need to. Sampras came into the net because his groundstrokes weren't brilliant enough to be relied upon to beat players - proved at RG year in, year out. Same with Henman, he still has to come into the net as his g/strokes are also not strong enough.

Sampras is the better volleyer, but I'd say Federer is in the same league. Nadal hasn't fully demonstrated his ability to volley, so I'd put him in the league below at the moment.

Well it is 1D, but when he's mastered the harder dimension, I think it's fair to say he's a good volleyer.

We can put Sampras in the same league as Fed for volleying if you like, but Sampras would be Champion's League material (along with Edberg, McEnroe) and Federer would be struggling against relegation :P

Seriously, I don't think Fed's volleys are anywhere as near as good as Sampras's, but each to their own. With Nadal we'll just have to wait and see, when someone only ventures to the net 5 times in a match, we'll never really know just how good his volleys can be, even if he wins all 5 points. Watch out for him at Wimbledon again this year though, let's hope he goes 3D.

Factual analysis only, if you please. No ifs and whens!! :D

Seriously, I am sure this discussion will be reopened at Wimbledon IF Nadal chooses to go 3-D, which I hope he does.

Shame that the art of the volley is in decline at the moment, I'd love to see some Edberg style brilliance once again.

Sorry, you misunderstood. I didn't mean that in a hypothetical sense; I believe he already has mastered the harder dimension of volleying, i.e. the stop volley. So therefore it's also already fair to say he's a good volleyer. Flawless factual analysis at its best, I think you'll find :D

Agree about serve-volley, I miss it so much at Wimbledon. I actually try to avoid old grass court clips because it saddens me to think what the grass court game has come to since all the brilliant serve volley duels. Edberg was a huge favourite of mine as well, I believe he and McEnroe are the greatest volleyers of all time. In my experience the greatest matches of all time consist of serve volley vs baseline; so while I understand the sentiments of others that Goran vs Pete matches weren't interesting, I personally find a lot of these all baseline matches at Wimbledon pretty dull. I still hold out hopes for an influx of serve volleyers again at some point :pray:

Are the defensive volleys not the easiest to make? Its when you've got to take a shot and do something with it that the real skill is involved.

Still, agree to disagree on Nadals relative volleying skills. He's been coming into the net more and more, which is good to see and I will be very interested to see how he showcases these skills at Wimbledon.

I think Karlovic is the nearest to a serve volley player at the moment...maybe a while before any GS wins on the back of this style.

I don't think so. The fact he, he does take the shot and turn it into something, i.e. a winner. Surely a defensive volley is much harder to hit a winner with than an attacking one?

Ancic should also be mentioned in terms of serve volleyers. He possesses a good serve and decent volleys, and his relative success on grass despite not being the best of serve-volleyers is what gives me hope that it isn't a lost art. The less said about Karlovic the better. I don't dislike him, but if he was a foot shorter, he'd be getting bagelled on the women's tour.

But surely defensive is easier because you are using the opponents pace? If you have to generate your own pace and put placement on it, it's more difficult?

:D I've yet to see Dr Ivo coming up with some good volleying, but apparently he has been of late...I'll be watching with interest. However, I don't think there is any immediate GS victories on the horizon....

As regards Ancic, I like watching him play, but I just don't see him winning anything either. Like you say, he does possess a good serve and decent volleys, but not enough to take a set off Federer.

Yes, but aren't we talking about stop volleys? So Nadal taking the pace off a fast ball and just dropping it over the net, for me, is much harder than merely directing it into the corner. Regardless, most attacking volleys are just as easy to hit as defensive volleys, because although you have to generate your own pace, you have more time to prepare the backswing. You need much firmer wrists for the defensive ones too.

The one other very tricky volley which I think is what you're getting at is the one where the ball is floated just over the net with little pace and dropping down at quite a steep angle. These are very difficult to deal with - I've seen Fed make countless errors on this type of shot. I've never seen Nadal hit one of these I don't think, but if he got that mastered, I'd recommend he started serve volleying quite often on grass, given the improvements in his serve.

Well last year at SW19 he'd had a couple of relative struggles against Wawrinka and Djokovic (first one held up for a day due to rain, second going to 5 sets) so he was probably jaded against Fed. He battered him in the first round in 2004, so I still think he could cause him problems on grass, albeit probably not win. Not this year though, he's been out too long.

I agree with Wise when he is saying that McEnroe was one of the major volleyer of all times even if I will never put Edberg very distant from him:

I really like so much Edberg's movements and the run he did at RG to reach the final..

:yikes: How a serve and volley like him mastered to reach that final well it was amazing ( even if to be fair we can always highlight that he had a relative easy draw that year, details here) ...BTW: If I think twice this is might be one of the reason about the fact that I do not like Chang...He was able to beat Edberg on that final :( :(

I do not agree with Wise when he is referring to FED's skills at the net: FED started as a serve and volley on grass. Besides, he was still using this technique a lot during his first Wimbledon title in 2003...
After he moved away from that..

The reasons why..Well we can present a long list..Certainly, one of the reasons, was simply because he discovered that he had enough weapons to beat his opponents from the baseline even on grass. And, as usual, as for any normal human being, once you have found the way to win something in a "quite easy" way there is no real motivation to change the method or to use some other part of your game...Said that, i.e. because he is no more using this technique as before, I really believe he has lost some of his touch: Still, his feeling at the net and his ability of volley properly is there, IMO it is only a question of getting back and train his "net touch" more....

Will he do that in the future? I do not know..We will see.. :rolleyes: