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Title: World Championship


Wise_Analyst - April 21, 2007 12:08 PM (GMT)
Unfortunately this tournament descended into farce last year, with a joke final and an even bigger joke winning.

O'Sullivan and Ding being drawn to play eachother in the first round was a pretty inauspicious start (Ronnie claimed the draw had been 'fixed'!) but it should still easily improve on the last couple of years:

Graeme Dott v Ian McCulloch
Anthony Hamilton v Marco Fu
Stephen Maguire v Joe Perry
Mark Williams v Joe Swail
John Higgins v Michael Holt
Barry Hawkins v Fergal O'Brien
Neil Robertson v Ryan Day
Ronnie O'Sullivan v Ding Junhui
Ken Doherty v Mark Allen
Matthew Stevens v Joe Delaney
Steve Davis v John Parrott
Shaun Murphy v Judd Trump
Peter Ebdon v Nigel Bond
Stephen Lee v Mark Selby
Ali Carter v Andy Hicks
Stephen Hendry v David Gilbert

The winner of the aforementioned match will definitely be one to look out for, although with O'Sullivan you never know. Elsewhere, I'd watch out for Peter Ebdon, who was very impressive in claiming the UK Championship in December.

Gav - April 21, 2007 05:26 PM (GMT)
I love snooker. I will be watching when I can. I have a feeling Stephen Maguire might well do something this year. I want to see Ronnie do well this year but what a tough first round match! The "fix" talk from Ronnier was all very tongue in cheek to be honest. I would love to see a Steve Davis run also.

I think there will be a sense of something missing with this being the first World Championship since Paul Hunter passed away and I hope he gets a mention at the end from the eventual winner of the tournament.

yorkshire - April 21, 2007 08:37 PM (GMT)
*Unfortunately this tournament descended into farce last year, with a joke final and an even bigger joke winning.*


Care to explain this comment please?

Tennis_Mad_Andy - April 22, 2007 02:36 AM (GMT)
Wise Analyst, I know that Dott got some stick last year after he won the World Championship and I can tell you don't like him either by the way you are labeling him as a joke etc... But at the end of the day, it doesn't matter how he won the World Championship, whether it be by making century after century or by winning long drawn out scrappy frames for nearly the whole final.

The fact of the matter is, he was playing Peter Ebdon who is a gritty and determined match player, and Dott matched him for determination and stamina and beat him. I know it wasn't a fluent century break building final but Dott never deserved the crticism he got, a World Championship win is a win and its a fantastic achievement whether you win it by fantastic snooker or by gritty and long drawn out tactical battles and scrappy frames.

He is also provisionally world number 1 leading upto the World Championship this year, you can't get any better than that in terms of rankings, so to call him a joke is just well... a joke to be honest! I have nothing against you at all Wise Analyst, but I am just a bit tired of hearing people criticising someone who won the world title last year. Anyone who wins that trophey is one of the worlds best snooker players, it doesn't matter who wins it, he still will be classed as one of the worlds best in my opinion.

I have been watching and playing snooker since I was about 5 years old so I am a big fan of the sport. Yes you can argue that Dott has already crashed out in the first round of this years tournament so his title defence fell at the first hurdle, but he had huge pressure on him and he was hurt by the criticism he got last year and also mculloch is not an easy first round opponent by any means!

Wise_Analyst - April 22, 2007 12:23 PM (GMT)
Hi TMA - point taken about Dott, although I've been watching snooker since the 80s and maintain that that was the worst Crucible final I've ever had the displeasure of witnessing. Dott's surely also the worst player ever to win it, but you're right - he did show true champion's credentials when he cleared the table at 16-14 after Ebdon finally mounted a comeback. Sadly, the amount of time he spent whinging about what a rough deal he gets hardly endeared him to me. The good news is, he's been knocked out already (I agree, McCulloch's an excellent player) so there'll be no need to continue this ;) What's your highest break btw?

Elsewhere, Ebdon has snuffed out Bond's astonishing comeback and leads 8-6. Parrott surprisingly leads Davis 6-3, and both Hamilton and Stevens are sitting pretty, 5 frames up against Fu and Delaney respectively.

yorkshire - April 22, 2007 02:20 PM (GMT)
I gather that when snooker was doing really well in the 80s there were a number of players who were called (in a somewhat derogatory fashion) "grinders". I'm thinking of players like Cliff Thorburn.

Some snooker followers probably don't, but I enjoy tactical battles just as much as break building. I can't forget Ronnie's wobbly when he lost to Ebdon. Fact is - Ebdon found Ronnie's weakness, exploited it and won.

There are plenty of attacking players at the moment and more coming through.

There's space at the top of the game for both kinds of player in my opinion. To be a really good player you need to combine both qualities anyway.

liam_valid - April 23, 2007 01:42 PM (GMT)
Well, O'Sullivan is trouncing Ding, just as i expected he would. He had a point to prove about the draw (justified or not) and theres no stopping him in that mood. I was gutted to see Davis go out last night, especially as i thought he was going to win that last frame, and then he got that shocking in off :angry:

Gav - April 23, 2007 02:35 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (liam_valid @ Apr 23 2007, 02:42 PM)
Well, O'Sullivan is trouncing Ding, just as i expected he would. He had a point to prove about the draw (justified or not) and theres no stopping him in that mood. I was gutted to see Davis go out last night, especially as i thought he was going to win that last frame, and then he got that shocking in off :angry:

Shockingly bad luck with that shot for Davis last night agreed. A shame he is out.

Go Ronnie!!!

Tenez - April 23, 2007 02:55 PM (GMT)
Sorry but I was happy for Parrot. Steve D is not my kind of players. I thought he was quite bitter in his after match interview talking about the red John was trying to get out of the pocket. He was close to calling John a cheat and that was very mean I thought.

So Ronnie takes care of Ding (that was meant to be the "Final", now in the second round we could have Robertson v Ronnie and this could have been a semi or a final as well!!! Whoeever wins this one shoudl plain sailing to the trophy.....

Gav - April 23, 2007 02:58 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (Tenez @ Apr 23 2007, 03:55 PM)
Sorry but I was happy for Parrot. Steve D is not my kind of players. I thought he was quite bitter in his after match interview talking about the red John was trying to get out of the pocket. He was close to calling John a cheat and that was very mean I thought.

So Ronnie takes care of Ding (that was meant to be the "Final", now in the second round we could have Robertson v Ronnie and this could have been a semi or a final as well!!!  Whoeever wins this one shoudl plain sailing to the trophy.....

I didn't see the post match interviews. I would be shocked if Davis said that without tongue firmly in cheek (jokingly) as they get on really well and laugh and joke about everything together as well as teasing each other constantly. And I will certainly be cheering Parrott on as he is a favourite of mine too.

Tenez - April 23, 2007 03:04 PM (GMT)
Maybe I missread it but you can find the interview on the bbc sport website.


Wise_Analyst - April 23, 2007 04:14 PM (GMT)
Tenez, I saw the interview live, it was all very tongue in cheek from Davis. Even if it hadn't been though, he'd have had a point - that seemed to be pretty questionable sportsmanship from Parrott. A good result for him, but a very poor one for Davis.

Speaking of poor results, Hawkins lost a final frame thriller to O'Brien; he really should have won this match. Murphy (can't stand this guy) is 5-4 up on the 17 year old Judd Trump at the mid-session interval, and Doherty's in a bit of trouble against Mark Allen. He was 4-1 down, and it should have been 5-1 but Allen missed an easy pink to allow the Irishman to claw it back.

Ronnie's result surprised me, I was hoping for a better match. O'Sullivan didn't play brilliantly, but Ding seemed to freeze... understandable given it's his first appearance in Sheffield. He had a few chances to capture one of the earlier frames, but failed - maybe if he'd won one of those, he would have settled in better. Let's hope Ronnie doesn't get bogged down by anything this tournament and plays to a high standard throughout; he should win if he does.

Tenez - April 23, 2007 07:01 PM (GMT)
I may have missed the subtleties of davis.

I agree with your views on the remaining of the post. Ronnie v Ding was pretty disappointing. Though it is always good to see ronnie on form...or on a stable form should I say.

Big Al - April 23, 2007 09:25 PM (GMT)
Ill be rooting for Ronnie throughout .
Wouldnt quite put money on him winning though ...

yorkshire - April 24, 2007 09:39 AM (GMT)
Saw some of the Murphy-Trump match yesterday. Was a very good match and although Murphy's experience saw him through in the end, Trump looks a very good prospect for the future. Went for too many pots as you might imagine for a 17 year old on his Crucible debut, but at times looked to have the makings of an excellent safety game as well.

I'm hoping for Murphy to do well in this tournament, his change in tactics impressed me. He realised that he probably wouldn't be able to outpot Trump, so he played a clever tactical game that in the end I think frustrated the youngster. But Trump will be back, there's no question about that.

Big Al - April 25, 2007 10:14 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (yorkshire @ Apr 24 2007, 10:39 AM)
Saw some of the Murphy-Trump match yesterday. Was a very good match and although Murphy's experience saw him through in the end, Trump looks a very good prospect for the future. Went for too many pots as you might imagine for a 17 year old on his Crucible debut, but at times looked to have the makings of an excellent safety game as well.

I'm hoping for Murphy to do well in this tournament, his change in tactics impressed me. He realised that he probably wouldn't be able to outpot Trump, so he played a clever tactical game that in the end I think frustrated the youngster. But Trump will be back, there's no question about that.

He'll come up trumps some day :P :wacko:
Couldnt resist that :blush:

Tenez - April 25, 2007 11:50 PM (GMT)
The Hendry v Gilber was really bad. Hendry was quite lucky hr did not have to face a better player. I think he will have to up his game if he wants a chance to go further.

Ronnie v Robertson - This is now the final in my view. It is a very difficult match for Ronnie and we should have some good breaks there.


Wise_Analyst - April 26, 2007 04:54 PM (GMT)
Hendry's been past it for a while now. Brilliant in his day, he simply makes too many careless mistakes now and I doubt he'll be much of a factor at these Championships even if he reaches the latter stages.

O'Sullivan vs Robertson should be a cracker (although we said that about the Ding match :wacko: ) but the final? Surely not. While an on-form Ronnie will beat anyone, the same cannot yet be said for Robertson and also we never really know which Ronnie is going to show up.

If O'Sullivan does win, which he probably will, I'd make him favourite to win overall. If he slips up and Robertson wins, there are players like Higgins, Maguire, Ebdon and Stevens who would all have a good chance of ousting the Australian.

Incidentally, Terry Griffiths claimed that he'd be 'very disappointed' if Maguire didn't win it this year. :blink: Have I missed something? Excellent player, but don't see any reason why his underachievement is set to come to an end, as much as I'd like it if it did.

Ian McCulloch (Eng) v A Hamilton (Eng)
Stephen Maguire (Sco) v Joe Swail (NI)
John Higgins (Sco) v Fergal O'Brien (Ire)
Neil Robertson (Aus) v Ronnie O'Sullivan (Eng)
Mark Allen (NI) v Matthew Stevens (Wal)
John Parrott (Eng) v Shaun Murphy (Eng)
Peter Ebdon (Eng) v Mark Selby (Eng)
Ali Carter (Eng) or Andy Hicks (Eng) v Stephen Hendry (Sco)

At a brief glance, the second quarter is by far the tightest. I'll predict Ronnie vs Maguire and Stevens vs Ebdon in the semis.

yorkshire - April 26, 2007 05:06 PM (GMT)
Maguire's a good player, but I agree - I can't see any evidence that he's ready to make the step up to the next level yet.

I have a good angle to add to this debate: commentators. Favourites? Less favourites?

My personal favourite is Clive Everton. Seems to find a good balance between keeping people informed and not waffling too much like some do. *cough* Virgo *cough*

Tenez - April 26, 2007 05:12 PM (GMT)
Higgins, Ebdon and Maguire have little chance to win this year. They are either off form or has been (same thing anyway).

It is going to be between Ronnie, Robertson and maybe Matthew or Murphy again. Allen played pretty well I must say too but probably now WC quality yet.

Tenez - April 26, 2007 05:14 PM (GMT)
Willie Thorn and Virgo for me. They are so good that when they are comenting I just listen and don't bother watching. Clive is hardly ever original or taking risk in his commentary.

yorkshire - April 26, 2007 05:19 PM (GMT)
Always amuses me when the commentators say something like "just needs this red" and then headphone-wearers in the crowd duly applaud when it goes in and Virgo says "well the knowledgable Crucible crowd applaud the winning pot" - Yeah they're knowledgable cos you just told them 30 seconds ago!!

I don't like Neal Foulds though. Don't know why, his voice just seems wrong for commentary somehow.

Tenez - April 26, 2007 05:23 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (yorkshire @ Apr 26 2007, 05:19 PM)
Always amuses me when the commentators say something like "just needs this red" and then headphone-wearers in the crowd duly applaud when it goes in and Virgo says "well the knowledgable Crucible crowd applaud the winning pot" - Yeah they're knowledgable cos you just told them 30 seconds ago!!.

:whistle: ;) Agreed. Do they think we are stupid? We know the trick. :rolleyes:

yorkshire - April 26, 2007 05:25 PM (GMT)
Virgo's "WHERE'S THE WHITE GOING?" outbursts always make me laugh as well.

Wise_Analyst - April 26, 2007 05:49 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (yorkshire @ Apr 26 2007, 06:25 PM)
Virgo's "WHERE'S THE WHITE GOING?" outbursts always make me laugh as well.

Especially when every time he does it, the white ball's miles from going into the pocket.

Most of the commentators have nuances which annoy the hell out of me. Virgo and Thorne are overly critical, given that they were nobodies in their day. Dennis Taylor can't help harping on about his one moment of glory in 1985 (which I watched; it was a huge choke from Davis). I find Everton simply very annoying and too bland.

Neil Foulds, Davis and Parrott are all quite good, but don't add any entertainment value. I do like the Virgo and Thorne combination, they provide amusement a lot of the time despite their negativity.

barrystar - April 26, 2007 05:56 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (Wise_Analyst @ Apr 26 2007, 05:49 PM)
Dennis Taylor can't help harping on about his one moment of glory in 1985 (which I watched; it was a huge choke from Davis).

Wise, give me a list of 5 matches, any sport, which were not decided by a choke in your view ;)

Wise_Analyst - April 26, 2007 05:57 PM (GMT)
Any tennis match in the 90s ;)

yorkshire - April 26, 2007 05:59 PM (GMT)
Any win when coming from behind (from any margin) is automatically a choke isn't it?

barrystar - April 26, 2007 06:00 PM (GMT)
I guess I asked for that one - liked the story of you falling for your GF's mum.

Mathemagician - April 26, 2007 08:27 PM (GMT)
South Africa against the Aussies....now THAT was a choke. Shame Wise never learned the meaning of the word but hey...

Back on topic...I think O'Sullivan will be slightly apprehensive of Robertson, Robertson doesn't seem intimidated by him, and I think Ronnie doesn't like not being able to strut his stuff and see the effect it has. Having said that, Robertson's also largely unproven in longer matches, and so I think O'Sullivan should come through.

Glad to see Graeme Dott out of it. Fair enough, he won last year, and he wont the same amount of frames, etc...but I still stand by what I said then- at a time when snooker was crying out for sponsors and audiences, that wasn't the advertisement they needed. Further to that, his character and game are the two most annoying things on the snooker circuit (edging smarmy donut boy Murphy into third).

Big Al - April 26, 2007 10:07 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (Wise_Analyst @ Apr 26 2007, 06:57 PM)
Any tennis match in the 90s ;)

Thanks for that totally unbiased and fact-based observation. :D

SuperBRAT - April 30, 2007 09:24 AM (GMT)
Love snooker but have hardly seen any of this so far, bene out a lot and away.

It's nto the samr for me though, although I am a big fan of Ronnie and Ebdon, plus the marvellous Steve Davis, the is a big loss this year

NO JIMMY WHITE!!!!! :( :( :( Sad. :( :( :(

Wise_Analyst - April 30, 2007 10:32 AM (GMT)
White's absence is a shame, but frankly it was rather embarassing watching such a legend lose to players like Barry Pinches over the last few years. The Tim Henman equivalent of snooker, I guess, only with 6 finals instead of semis. SB, did you know White's actually working as a pundit for the BBC this tournament? I must say he's better than most of the rest of them. It was sad to hear just how lost he felt entering the Crucible for the first time without his cue.

Elsewhere, Hendry is out, playing poorly against an inspired Ali Carter and getting thrashed in the end. Higgins is also through.

Anthony Hamilton (Eng) vs Stephen Maguire (Sco)
John Higgins (Sco) vs Ronnie O'Sullivan (Eng) OR Neil Robertson (Aus)
Matthew Stevens (Wal) vs Shaun Murphy (Eng)
Peter Ebdon (Eng) OR Mark Selby (Eng) vs Ali Carter (Eng)

O'Sullivan is 8-4 up against Robertson and should go through. Robertson missed a very simple frame ball blue yesterday at 1-1 which indicated he's just not ready yet at the Crucible.

Interestingly though, Selby is 7-4 up on Ebdon, which comes as a shock. If he could go through there, we'd have an interesting quarter final between him and Carter, a battle of the young guns. But for me the winner of this tournament is coming from the winner of the prospective Ronnie vs Higgins QF.


yorkshire - April 30, 2007 10:42 AM (GMT)
Selby's playing brilliantly this morning, just knocked in 3 centuries in 3 frames, Ebdon's hardly been at the table.

Amusing foul by Ebdon when he followed through and hit the yellow by mistake. :D

Selesdavcaprisharaserenafan - May 1, 2007 07:53 AM (GMT)
Selby Knocked out Ebdon 13-8, with O'sullivan got Roberston in a Jam, beating him 13-10 with Robertson making vital mistakes at 10-all

Tenez - May 1, 2007 08:18 AM (GMT)
As mentioned Robertson v Sullivan the virtual was the final.

Selesdavcaprisharaserenafan - May 1, 2007 08:29 AM (GMT)
QUOTE (Tenez @ May 1 2007, 02:18 AM)
As mentioned Robertson v Sullivan the virtual was the final.

I don't believe it was - Higgins will be a bigger test for Ronnie, he is a top, top player and has been for years. I fancy him to beat O'Sullivan.

Back Selby to get to the final on the other side - he's a Leicester lad, he is also the reigning 8 ball pool champion having only gone into the event as a random wildcard! He's a future snooker world champ too I reckon

Gav - May 1, 2007 08:48 AM (GMT)
I agree Higgins will put up one hell of a fight with Ronnie I reckon and it's touch and go as to who will go through. We all know there are two Ronnie's that can show up to matches like this.

Stephen Maguire is still an outside bet for me to reach the final, but I fancy the winner of the Stephens/Murphy match to make it from the other half of the draw.

Selesdavcaprisharaserenafan - May 1, 2007 08:54 AM (GMT)
QUOTE (Gav @ May 1 2007, 02:48 AM)
I agree Higgins will put up one hell of a fight with Ronnie I reckon and it's touch and go as to who will go through. We all know there are two Ronnie's that can show up to matches like this.

Stephen Maguire is still an outside bet for me to reach the final, but I fancy the winner of the Stephens/Murphy match to make it from the other half of the draw.

It might be steven's year - I can't see Murphy getting to the final that's for sure, not enough of an all-round game for me.

Selby's the man B)

Selesdavcaprisharaserenafan - May 1, 2007 08:55 AM (GMT)
Maguire is also a good player I forgot to mention, a couple of years ago he looked like he would be a dominant force, but it hasn't quite happened




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